Comments on: Java 6 on Mac OS X - When? http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/ Random braindumps vaguely related to coding Tue, 06 Jan 2009 01:57:39 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: Liam Clancy (metafeather) http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-103 Liam Clancy (metafeather) Mon, 29 Oct 2007 20:50:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-103 If you are a full time Mac based Java Developer, I suggest getting a Apple Select Developer Membership ($499), get your 20% discount on hardware for a nice new MacBook Pro:<br/><br/> http://developer.apple.com/membership/hardware.html<br/><br/>save minimum $400 on hardware, get free seed versions of OS X (save $129) and look under the 'Java' section of the Developer Connection.<br/><br/>If you are in the UK then claim back the cost of the MacBook Pro to boot:<br/><br/> http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/helpsheets/ir206.pdf<br/><br/>If you are not, you can wait a few weeks whilst the rest of us feedback on bugs to Apple to make sure everything is cosy. If you are a full time Mac based Java Developer, I suggest getting a Apple Select Developer Membership ($499), get your 20% discount on hardware for a nice new MacBook Pro:

http://developer.apple.com/membership/hardware.html

save minimum $400 on hardware, get free seed versions of OS X (save $129) and look under the ‘Java’ section of the Developer Connection.

If you are in the UK then claim back the cost of the MacBook Pro to boot:

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/helpsheets/ir206.pdf

If you are not, you can wait a few weeks whilst the rest of us feedback on bugs to Apple to make sure everything is cosy.

]]> By: Julian Doherty http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-102 Julian Doherty Sat, 27 Oct 2007 01:12:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-102 Yeah, I'm definitely starting to get disillusioned with the whole thing.<br/><br/>Not a word on Java 6 for a year since the pre-release developer version. Yeah, I’m definitely starting to get disillusioned with the whole thing.

Not a word on Java 6 for a year since the pre-release developer version.

]]> By: Colin http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-101 Colin Fri, 26 Oct 2007 15:55:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-101 Just installed Leopard and Dev Tools. No Java 6.<br/><br/>They've completely removed my ability to developer modern Java apps on their OS and have given me no indication they ever plan to support Java in the future.<br/><br/>Supposedly they want to sell hardware. This isn't the way to do it. Just installed Leopard and Dev Tools. No Java 6.

They’ve completely removed my ability to developer modern Java apps on their OS and have given me no indication they ever plan to support Java in the future.

Supposedly they want to sell hardware. This isn’t the way to do it.

]]> By: Paul http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-98 Paul Tue, 02 Oct 2007 13:36:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-98 Apple's greed will never allow them to support the Java community. As was said above, they have money to make on other things and don't have time to care about developers who want to put software out on their OS.<br/><br/>This is really simple, MAC OSX is built from a UNIX base. Java 6 has worked on UNIX since the day it came out. Why is it so hard to get it to work on a Mac? Because somewhere in Apple-land some jerk has shuffled it to the bottom of his desk, never to be seen again.<br/><br/>Apple, disappointing everybody but graphics designers... since ever. Apple’s greed will never allow them to support the Java community. As was said above, they have money to make on other things and don’t have time to care about developers who want to put software out on their OS.

This is really simple, MAC OSX is built from a UNIX base. Java 6 has worked on UNIX since the day it came out. Why is it so hard to get it to work on a Mac? Because somewhere in Apple-land some jerk has shuffled it to the bottom of his desk, never to be seen again.

Apple, disappointing everybody but graphics designers… since ever.

]]> By: oogifu http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-54 oogifu Sat, 02 Jun 2007 10:12:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-54 I have to agree with ‘anonymous’. Apple does not care at all about the Java so-called community or even the Java developers who bought a Mac Book Pro. (Java) Developers represent a tiny percentage of Apple’s clientele. Their market usually has been the ‘creative/artist/designer’. Now their market is about iPods and selling songs on iTunes; and selling (relatively expensive) hardware.<br/><br/>And it is fair.<br/><br/>I do not think that Mac is a great development platform: Xcode sucks, Eclipse runs ok: for me it is still Windows + Eclipse + Cygwin….. oh yeah, and the latest production-ready JDK 6.<br/><br/>As a developer, I will simply not upgrade/buy anymore Apple (read laptop) products until they clearly commit to Java: but they won’t. What would be really exciting, for each JDK to have Apple commit to https://jdk7-osx.dev.java.net/ or something equivalent… I have to agree with ‘anonymous’. Apple does not care at all about the Java so-called community or even the Java developers who bought a Mac Book Pro. (Java) Developers represent a tiny percentage of Apple’s clientele. Their market usually has been the ‘creative/artist/designer’. Now their market is about iPods and selling songs on iTunes; and selling (relatively expensive) hardware.

And it is fair.

I do not think that Mac is a great development platform: Xcode sucks, Eclipse runs ok: for me it is still Windows + Eclipse + Cygwin….. oh yeah, and the latest production-ready JDK 6.

As a developer, I will simply not upgrade/buy anymore Apple (read laptop) products until they clearly commit to Java: but they won’t. What would be really exciting, for each JDK to have Apple commit to https://jdk7-osx.dev.java.net/ or something equivalent…

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-53 Anonymous Fri, 01 Jun 2007 15:47:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-53 My company makes a shrink-wrapped java suite of applications for a niche market. We support Windows and Linux. I'm a Mac user that would love to work on my Mac at work (which we're allowed to do as long as its tested on a supported platform). But I can't because our app won't compile on a Mac using the preview 1.6 JDK. I've heard numerous people say, "you don't NEED to use 1.6 then". I disagree. First, there are several bug fixes in 1.6 that we (our customers) require. Second, large scale apps (like ours) take months and years to develop. Switching to the latest JDK sooner, affords us much more time to test the new JDK and it's new features that I'm using.<br/><br/>Also, I understand Apple makes money selling hardware. They've lost some sales because of this. We were considering selling mac minis pre-bundled with our software. But we wound up going with AOpen's lackluster substitute.<br/><br/>Just another point of view. They really need to release AT LEAST an updated beta version. My company makes a shrink-wrapped java suite of applications for a niche market. We support Windows and Linux. I’m a Mac user that would love to work on my Mac at work (which we’re allowed to do as long as its tested on a supported platform). But I can’t because our app won’t compile on a Mac using the preview 1.6 JDK. I’ve heard numerous people say, “you don’t NEED to use 1.6 then”. I disagree. First, there are several bug fixes in 1.6 that we (our customers) require. Second, large scale apps (like ours) take months and years to develop. Switching to the latest JDK sooner, affords us much more time to test the new JDK and it’s new features that I’m using.

Also, I understand Apple makes money selling hardware. They’ve lost some sales because of this. We were considering selling mac minis pre-bundled with our software. But we wound up going with AOpen’s lackluster substitute.

Just another point of view. They really need to release AT LEAST an updated beta version.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-52 Anonymous Fri, 01 Jun 2007 13:39:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-52 Well if they announced their intentions, then Java developers would stop buying Apple machines, so they're not likely to do anything like that.<br/><br/>Why not just assume the worst and get on with your own version. That was one of the reasons for open sourcing Java wasn't it? So that you could not be immune to shifts in a company's priorities and fortunes? Well if they announced their intentions, then Java developers would stop buying Apple machines, so they’re not likely to do anything like that.

Why not just assume the worst and get on with your own version. That was one of the reasons for open sourcing Java wasn’t it? So that you could not be immune to shifts in a company’s priorities and fortunes?

]]> By: Julian Doherty http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-51 Julian Doherty Fri, 01 Jun 2007 11:37:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-51 Anon - I think you're right. There really isn't any incentive for Apple to produce Java 6. As Simon Brocklehurst said in the original post I referenced, the open source community could be leading the way. It's just a matter of communication from Apple more than anything. <br/><br/>If they're going to stop supporting Java, then at least announce their intentions, and allow developers to focus on something more productive in the mean time rather than waiting around for a release out of Apple that might be months or years away. Anon - I think you’re right. There really isn’t any incentive for Apple to produce Java 6. As Simon Brocklehurst said in the original post I referenced, the open source community could be leading the way. It’s just a matter of communication from Apple more than anything.

If they’re going to stop supporting Java, then at least announce their intentions, and allow developers to focus on something more productive in the mean time rather than waiting around for a release out of Apple that might be months or years away.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-50 Anonymous Fri, 01 Jun 2007 11:12:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-50 You have to realize that Apple does not care about Java, at all. They care about selling *hardware* at a huge profit, and millions of songs via iTunes at a small profit.<br/><br/>Steve Jobs thinks that Java is everything and nothing. Furthermore, Apple did not invent Java, so it must be bad. Oh... we cannot make any money with Java as well.. so why bother: some idiot will port it to Mac OS X, we'll fire our Java engineers, and we'll even save money.<br/><br/>We have to stop asking Apple "do this, do that", it is a corporation that only cares about its profits, and it is fair. You have to realize that Apple does not care about Java, at all. They care about selling *hardware* at a huge profit, and millions of songs via iTunes at a small profit.

Steve Jobs thinks that Java is everything and nothing. Furthermore, Apple did not invent Java, so it must be bad. Oh… we cannot make any money with Java as well.. so why bother: some idiot will port it to Mac OS X, we’ll fire our Java engineers, and we’ll even save money.

We have to stop asking Apple “do this, do that”, it is a corporation that only cares about its profits, and it is fair.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-48 Anonymous Wed, 30 May 2007 23:05:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-48 @augusto, sorry, I completely disagree with your statement.<br/><br/>I suggest you re-read the post. Julian didn't say that OS X is a good "Java version release platform". Nope, that's not what he was complaining about.<br/><br/>He said that OS X was a good development environment. Two very, very different things.<br/><br/>Please, before posting on websites, keep it on topic. @augusto, sorry, I completely disagree with your statement.

I suggest you re-read the post. Julian didn’t say that OS X is a good “Java version release platform”. Nope, that’s not what he was complaining about.

He said that OS X was a good development environment. Two very, very different things.

Please, before posting on websites, keep it on topic.

]]> By: Julian Doherty http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-47 Julian Doherty Wed, 30 May 2007 21:23:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-47 Agree with Sparklethoughts. Mac OS X as a general development environment is great, and Java 1.5 does run fine. It's just that there are a lot of useful features in Java 1.6, and it's better release with performance buffs and various fixes.<br/><br/>OS X as a development platform must be a huge growth area for Apple at the moment, and Java is a huge segment within that market. It's a shame that Apple doesn't provide the tools.<br/><br/>I've got no idea what the politics and licenses are around the JDK on OS X, but maybe Apple should be handing control of them over to Sun or as an open source project. Agree with Sparklethoughts. Mac OS X as a general development environment is great, and Java 1.5 does run fine. It’s just that there are a lot of useful features in Java 1.6, and it’s better release with performance buffs and various fixes.

OS X as a development platform must be a huge growth area for Apple at the moment, and Java is a huge segment within that market. It’s a shame that Apple doesn’t provide the tools.

I’ve got no idea what the politics and licenses are around the JDK on OS X, but maybe Apple should be handing control of them over to Sun or as an open source project.

]]> By: sparklethoughts http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-46 sparklethoughts Wed, 30 May 2007 21:13:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-46 I run on mac-only for my development, and do enjoy it far more than any other platform (great operating system combined with supporting the tools I need - glassfish and netbeans mostly), but I do agree that it's very annoying to have silence from Apple on their java strategy. They've always been like this - I remember having to deal with no JDK15 for so long after it came out, and it really was a pain. <br/><br/>They certainly <a HREF="http://developer.apple.com/java/" REL="nofollow">hype</a> their support for it, so it's far past time for them to deliver. First rule of customer service: let your customers know what is going on, even if you can't immediately deliver. I'd bet you people would complain a lot less if one of the java@apple.com members frequently posted updates (or had a blog, imagine that!). I run on mac-only for my development, and do enjoy it far more than any other platform (great operating system combined with supporting the tools I need - glassfish and netbeans mostly), but I do agree that it’s very annoying to have silence from Apple on their java strategy. They’ve always been like this - I remember having to deal with no JDK15 for so long after it came out, and it really was a pain.

They certainly hype their support for it, so it’s far past time for them to deliver. First rule of customer service: let your customers know what is going on, even if you can’t immediately deliver. I’d bet you people would complain a lot less if one of the java@apple.com members frequently posted updates (or had a blog, imagine that!).

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-45 Anonymous Wed, 30 May 2007 20:03:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-45 I agree - it's a pretty big disappointment that they are:<br/><br/>1. slow to release updates<br/>2. require ADC registration to download less-than-recent builds of the JRE (try to explain that to your customers)<br/><br/>I can understand that they want to support the SDI for Apple and provide their little hooks to do so. Why not make this a tertiary adapter however? Would be nice to be able to use the stock JDK. I agree - it’s a pretty big disappointment that they are:

1. slow to release updates
2. require ADC registration to download less-than-recent builds of the JRE (try to explain that to your customers)

I can understand that they want to support the SDI for Apple and provide their little hooks to do so. Why not make this a tertiary adapter however? Would be nice to be able to use the stock JDK.

]]> By: Augusto http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-44 Augusto Wed, 30 May 2007 19:01:00 +0000 http://www.rawblock.com/2007/05/30/java-6-on-mac-os-x-when/#comment-44 This plainly shows that OSX is not a good environment for Java development. Trying the JRE/JDK releases to a particular OS version upgrade is a horrible idea.<br/><br/>I don't understand how so many Sun employees put up with this, when the platform they are using doesn't support the latest and greatest. This plainly shows that OSX is not a good environment for Java development. Trying the JRE/JDK releases to a particular OS version upgrade is a horrible idea.

I don’t understand how so many Sun employees put up with this, when the platform they are using doesn’t support the latest and greatest.

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